Gary Cowan - From Rockway to Augusta: My Life in Golf

In this episode, Nate chats with a legendary golfer, Gary Cowan, to cover his early life, career highlights, lessons learned, and reflections on golf's history and culture. Discover inspiring stories, key insights, and timeless advice from a master of the game.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_01 1:15

It's pretty cool to have your life turned into a book.

SPEAKER_03 1:18

Yeah, it is. That's right.

SPEAKER_01 1:21

What made you want to write the book?

SPEAKER_03 1:23

Why did I want to write the book? Because because no one uh really knew what I did. I kept a lot to myself. And I and I figured it was time to write a write a story, and that's what I did.

SPEAKER_01 1:36

How long did it take you? Oh, it took me about a year and a half. And you had some people help you out?

SPEAKER_03 1:45

Yeah, I had uh well um what what's his name? Uh David uh m McPherson helped me for a little bit, but uh I I had I had some other people who really really helped me. Like I had Gulf Canada and I had uh Jerry Sullivan and so on. So I mean I had some people um you know looking at me. So I mean um so what I did uh I uh I I did all the writing by hand and and then I had uh I talked to uh Jerry Sullivan and then he corrected a lot of it for me and then uh I would talk to Megan and and sort of did it that way and then that was that was how I how I went about it. Wow I started it from uh right from D1 when I was like eight, nine years old, and I did I just went right all the way along there.

SPEAKER_01 2:49

Yes, sir. Um can you tell me uh a little bit about Kitchener, Ontario, what kind of town it is?

SPEAKER_03 2:57

Well Kitchener, they're they're it's they're they're they're they're called Twin Cities. It's Kitchener, Waterloo. They're um back in the day they were there were maybe eighty eighty thousand people. Now there's like three hundred, but uh it it's it's a twin city and uh there's uh two or three c uh universities in Waterloo and so on and so forth, and but it it was uh it was a real manufacturing piece uh person for people or town. Um and uh it used to be called Berlin before the First World War.

SPEAKER_02 3:35

Wow.

SPEAKER_03 3:36

And then and then it was changed to a Kitchener uh after uh they they uh found the the the Kaiser in the in the in the lake. Are you still there today? Um if he's is he still there?

SPEAKER_02 3:53

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 3:54

Oh I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 4:02

Oh, okay.

SPEAKER_03 4:04

Yeah, so I mean he I don't know where he is where it is. It's a long time ago. Just a hundred years ago.

SPEAKER_01 4:11

You you grew up playing hockey and baseball before golf, right?

SPEAKER_03 4:16

That's right, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:18

And there there's a cool little tidbit in the book that you learned how to skate on a frozen swamp.

SPEAKER_03 4:24

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was just um that's how you get started, you know, you get kids and that's how you do it.

SPEAKER_01 4:33

Yeah, just find anywhere where you can skate, huh?

SPEAKER_03 4:36

Yeah, yeah. It would freeze over and then then you know then you'd have some fun.

SPEAKER_01 4:43

Mm-hmm. And um it's from what I remember early in the book, you got a newspaper route and then you read a story about Jerry Kesselring, and that kind of got the wheels turned in your head about golf?

SPEAKER_03 4:57

Well, yeah, I did uh because what I said when I said to myself, I said, I said, I'd like to do something like that. I'd like to get my name in the paper and stuff like that. So that sort of but it wasn't really golf yet. It was just you know, that was before I was even uh, you know, I was like six, seven years old.

SPEAKER_01 5:21

Wow. You just knew you wanted your name in the paper somehow.

SPEAKER_03 5:25

Yeah, yeah, that's probably right.

SPEAKER_01 5:27

And then um a friend named Chuck Burkeholder asked you to go look for golf balls one day at Rockway.

SPEAKER_03 5:34

Yeah, yeah, that's right. And then that's how I got started.

SPEAKER_01 5:41

That was close to your house, the course? Oh, it's about three blocks away. Okay. And then your dad bought you one single golf club, huh? A five iron? Yeah, a five iron.

SPEAKER_03 5:55

So I used that to hunt balls with and and and batter bag it around.

SPEAKER_01 6:01

Do you remember how much it cost? Could you guess? No, I no idea.

SPEAKER_03 6:05

Probably got it for nothing.

SPEAKER_01 6:07

Yeah. Was was it something that you liked right away? Was it something that you had to grow to like?

SPEAKER_03 6:15

No, it was it was just it was just something to uh uh I'm like when I'm hunting for golf balls, uh you need something to hang on to. So I looked at my five iron.

SPEAKER_01 6:27

Uh-huh. Yeah, so that's how I did it. Would you use the five iron to hit the golf balls too?

SPEAKER_03 6:33

Oh yeah, oh yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_01 6:36

And then you still you were selling some golf balls to the to to the golfers at Rockway and the the pro found out, right? Lloyd Tucker?

SPEAKER_03 6:44

Yeah, I found out and then he uh he made made me uh he I I had to go up to the pro shop and he said you filmed to me from now on.

SPEAKER_01 6:55

And that's how and then you started working in that same golf shop, right?

SPEAKER_03 6:58

Yeah, eventually there, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:01

And what what age were you when you you decided to give up baseball and just focus on golf?

SPEAKER_03 7:07

Um I was like like 13, 12, or 13.

SPEAKER_01 7:11

Okay. And then in in chapter three, there's a cool little story about, you know, when you started playing competitively, you went up to uh the Labat Open uh for the Pro Junior and you watched an exhibition with Babe Zaharias.

SPEAKER_03 7:26

Yeah, that's right, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:28

What do you do you remember anything specific about that?

SPEAKER_03 7:32

No, not really other other than uh, you know, she was a female obviously and could hit the ball really nice. So uh, you know, so I was just one of the one of the kids watching her.

SPEAKER_01 7:43

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 7:43

And I thought it was pretty cool.

SPEAKER_01 7:45

And you did some caddying too, right?

SPEAKER_03 7:48

Uh well no, I I actually played. I played around with uh with uh Lloyd Tucker.

SPEAKER_01 7:54

Right.

SPEAKER_03 7:54

And and then and another another guy. Uh yeah, Junior there too, I think.

SPEAKER_01 8:00

Yep. But then besides for that tournament, you did you you caddied, was it at Rockway that you caddied?

SPEAKER_03 8:07

Yeah, I caddied in Rockway. Yeah, that's where I did it all.

SPEAKER_01 8:11

And uh another one of my favorite little stories was when there was a member who let you hit a drive on the 15th hole until you outdrove him.

SPEAKER_03 8:21

Yeah, that's right. And the once I owed him, that was it.

SPEAKER_01 8:24

He wouldn't anymore. He wouldn't let you do it anymore.

SPEAKER_03 8:27

Yeah, I was like uh 14.

SPEAKER_01 8:31

How much were you making caddying? How much money do you think you made? How much money do you think you were making as a caddy?

SPEAKER_03 8:39

Oh, I don't know, probably two dollars.

SPEAKER_01 8:41

Yeah, now they make$150.

SPEAKER_03 8:45

But that wasn't that was enough for uh uh a hamburger, a hot dog, and a milkshake.

SPEAKER_01 8:52

That's great.

SPEAKER_03 8:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 8:55

And um, so there was a there was a fatherhouser at your school who who kind of pulled you in and you know told you you were wasting your time at at the school and you needed to learn a trade. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

SPEAKER_03 9:08

Uh not a whole lot because I just uh I went to uh business college and uh um you know got a a degree and I don't know what even it was in, but uh I ended up uh working for uh Dominion Lights the next year. So and then um that's that's where I that's where I ended up uh for a couple of years, two and a half years.

SPEAKER_01 9:34

He told you that all you thought about was golf. Was that true? Yeah, that's true. Um and then I also liked reading about your time with Mo Norman. Yeah. So for a couple a couple winters you you drove down south with him.

SPEAKER_03 9:53

No, just one winter just one winter.

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Okay, what was it like playing golf with him?

SPEAKER_03 9:59

Well, I mean it was uh my my friend uh who was with me, uh tell shit, just said he said he said I was still working at Dominion Life. And he said to me, he said, Gary, he said, you gotta come down with me because I'm not gonna be able to handle uh Mo Norman by myself. So anyway, so we did that. So I spent uh I guess six weeks uh playing point uh like 36 holes every day with him.

SPEAKER_01 10:29

And didn't you guys win a tournament together?

SPEAKER_03 10:31

Uh probably.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

Yeah, Pro and at Daytona Beach. You made a hole in one.

SPEAKER_03 10:37

Uh yeah, that's probably true.

SPEAKER_01 10:39

All that stuff. That's crazy.

unknown 10:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 10:43

And um, and then by by 18, you you played in your first Canadian Open with, you know, Palmer, Venturi, Billy Casper. 18 years old. That's pretty special.

SPEAKER_03 10:54

Yeah, that was at that was at Westmount. That was uh Kitchener at Westmouth. That that was uh that was the 100th anniversary of Seagram.

SPEAKER_01 11:03

Oh wow.

SPEAKER_03 11:05

So that's that was that's how they had the uh the uh Canadian Open at at Westmouth.

SPEAKER_01 11:11

It must have been pretty special playing with those pros when you were, you know, still just a teenager. Do you remember you know getting to meet them or seeing them at all?

SPEAKER_03 11:21

Oh yeah, uh well I I had known uh you know some of them. Uh I mean I played 36 Old with uh Gabe Brewer. Wow. Uh for the first uh 36 old, you know, he's just starting out too. Like everyone else was just really starting out, so anyway, so and then uh then I played one one round with Al Balding and and uh I don't even remember who the other one was. And I I also like he was he was from Canada too, hey, Al Balding.

SPEAKER_01 11:53

Yep. I also liked the little story in there about when you went you went to Augusta with Mo Norman, you were fishing balls out of the pond in front of the 15th green at Augusta. Probably couldn't do that today.

SPEAKER_03 12:06

No, not a chance. But but you know, um Mo was the kind of guy that uh he just wanted to go and play golf. That's all he wanted to do.

SPEAKER_02 12:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 12:17

So he takes taking clubs and just go and play. And you know, we're we're not gonna we're not gonna caddy for him.

SPEAKER_01 12:25

Yep.

SPEAKER_03 12:26

He could do that himself. So so that's how it all happened.

SPEAKER_01 12:30

You had to find something to do.

SPEAKER_03 12:32

Yeah, you got it.

SPEAKER_01 12:34

And then um another thing that I enjoyed reading about was in the America's Cup match, you beat Harvey Ward, and he he gave you a little bit of advice not to hit less than a four-iron out of the rough.

SPEAKER_03 12:48

Yeah, yeah. And I to this day that's uh I still do still do that.

SPEAKER_01 12:53

That's cool.

SPEAKER_03 12:54

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But that's that that's with that's part of growing up. You know, you you you you put all these things together and you either use them or you don't.

SPEAKER_01 13:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 13:06

And uh and that's uh that's how you learn. That's that's how uh that's how I learned. And then I'm sure uh uh a lot of other people maybe don't even do that anymore because they just what do you know about it? Right. Yeah, so anyway, uh that's how I learned. And and uh I I just feel so so lucky to have been able to to do all that.

SPEAKER_01 13:28

1960, you made your first trip to Marion for the World Amateur team event, you know, with people from all over the world, right? And Jack Nicholas just dominated, huh?

SPEAKER_03 13:39

Yeah, he really did. That was that was one of the one of his greatest tournaments. So it was it was so special. And I didn't play very well. I think I shot uh 315 or something like that, which isn't wasn't very good.

SPEAKER_02 13:55

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 13:57

And then the next year Go ahead. I was gonna say so so the so the next time when I played in the uh in the amateur, I thought, well, I should be able to do better than that.

SPEAKER_01 14:08

And you sure did. Yeah, yeah. And then 1961, I think, was your first Canadian amateur win after you lost in the finals the year before and and people kept calling you golf's bridesmaid.

SPEAKER_03 14:22

Yeah, yeah, I lost uh I lost the um in in 59 and 60, and then I won it in 61. So so that got me back into the master for the first time.

SPEAKER_01 14:35

Mm-hmm. And it you played with Sam Sneed in the par three contest that year?

SPEAKER_03 14:40

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 14:42

And you I think you had some success in that Masters. You shot seventy-one on day one, and then you made the cut on the number, 77 day two.

SPEAKER_03 14:51

Yeah, that was in that was in 64.

SPEAKER_01 14:54

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 14:55

I was the first the first masters I made was was in 1962.

SPEAKER_01 14:59

Okay. Sixty-four was when you made the cut?

SPEAKER_03 15:02

Yeah. I made two cuts. Sixty-four and sixty-eight.

SPEAKER_01 15:08

Sixty-five and played with Byron now.

SPEAKER_03 15:11

It's not easy when you're uh you're up up up up in Canada all winter, then you have to go and start playing golf again for two or three weeks. Right.

SPEAKER_01 15:19

Yeah, I liked reading about the stories when you kind of went down south to prepare. Yeah, yeah. Um and uh what if it seemed like, you know, when you came back to Marion the second time that, you know, some of your experience in, you know, the national events both in Canada and the US helped you out and you were kind of ready for the moment, ready to to win a big a big time amateur tournament in the US?

SPEAKER_03 15:50

Well, yeah, I mean I had I had won a number of things. I was low amateur and a world world thing in Japan and so on. I mean, so I I but I just I I did my thing. I uh if I made a team, uh then I went out and played and and I I I was pretty good. So so that's that's that's uh you you don't you don't know whether you're gonna win anything.

SPEAKER_01 16:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 16:14

But you just you just do as best you can.

SPEAKER_01 16:17

And you shot 67 in the final round to tie Dean Beaman and s and get into that playoff.

SPEAKER_03 16:24

Yeah, well, I was like an hour ahead of him, at least an hour ahead of him, so you know I had everything packed. I'm ready to go back, go home with Bob Bradley and myself, and and then uh he said, Well, let's wait around and see what happens. So that's what we did. And then things happened.

SPEAKER_01 16:44

Yep. And it it's I didn't know about this in the playoff, still back in that day they had the continuous putting role, so Beaman had to putt until he holded out. That was on 18.

SPEAKER_03 16:57

Yeah. So you know he had to hold it out, so he had a long putt like 80-90 feet, and he left it about ten feet short. And if he doesn't make it, uh I can I can three putt and win.

SPEAKER_02 17:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 17:10

But uh but he made it so now I got a two-put to win. So anyway, I I just uh got it down got it in a little hard and left it about nine feet away and then uh made it coming back. And that was it. That's all she wrote.

SPEAKER_01 17:29

And it w it's interesting too that even though you w won, people said that Dean Beaman lost the amateur rather than giving you credit. Yeah, that's right. That's what happened. It seemed like that kind of gave you motivation, especially, you know, the the next time at Wilmington.

SPEAKER_03 17:49

Uh yeah, well it it uh you know it uh like I I I finished I finished third in um in 1970.

SPEAKER_02 17:58

Uh-huh.

SPEAKER_03 17:59

Uh uh UX amateur and and then uh I had a chance to win there and then I didn't, and then uh 71 come along and uh that's it. So you know you just you you just gotta you go and play and you and you do what you have to do, and and if you play well, you you got a chance to win.

SPEAKER_01 18:19

Um there's some interesting stories from that 71 tournament. You uh you had a three-shot lead after nine holes, I think, in the third round, and then you got stung by a B.

SPEAKER_03 18:30

Yeah, well, that's that's his little stuff. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:34

You got stung, but you still shot 69 and were leading going into the final round.

SPEAKER_03 18:40

Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_01 18:42

And can you take us through that that shot that um you called the greatest shot of your career?

SPEAKER_03 18:49

Yeah, well, uh, you know, so I mean uh I I'm uh you know I I'm I'm on the uh on uh I'm on the fairway waiting for the group ahead of us to um uh to to to leave the green kind of thing. And Phil Scrooby is giving me uh uh a hard time all day long. So I I sort of said to Phil, I said, I are you going to uh penalize me if I go up and see where the pin was or go or see where the score was, which I knew he wouldn't. He said, Well, I would, I'd have to. So then uh I said, Well you mind if I go up and see where the pin was, which I could do. He said, Well you can't do that, you're delaying play.

SPEAKER_01 19:34

After uh they said you're gonna delay play, that kind of ticked you off?

SPEAKER_03 19:38

It didn't it didn't uh it didn't tick me off. It just uh it just made me uh I I had to go and do it, so uh you know, I gotta go and do it. Yeah. So that's what I did.

SPEAKER_01 19:51

And did you know did you know when you hit it that it was a good shot? What were you feeling when like when the ball was in the air?

SPEAKER_03 19:59

Well, when when it when I I knew that uh I had hit a I hit a a wedge from the day before almost from the same spot and I ended up short. So I I said I'll hit a nine iron this time, and uh, you know, once I got it up in the air, I said to myself, Oh, this is gonna be pretty good. And then it got up that hill and started rolling, and I'm saying, well maybe I hit it too hard, and but the people uh there didn't they they s they they just sort of went booing and that so I knew it was pretty close and then it went in.

SPEAKER_01 20:35

That's a pretty incredible accomplishment to w to win two U.S. amateurs.

SPEAKER_03 20:42

Yeah, for an old guy like me.

SPEAKER_01 20:46

So you were back at the Masters um in 71 and you had a little bit of a run-in with the security at night. Do you remember that?

SPEAKER_03 20:56

Oh, I remember that, yeah. With uh Marty West.

SPEAKER_02 21:02

Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_03 21:03

Yeah, and we're we're uh we're playing bridge with um um Dave Spencer, one of the pros and that is white. And uh we we get to uh and uh uh Dave said uh well we don't have to go over that, you know, and we'll uh the there was uh eleven o'clock curfew time. So anyway, he's I'll get you in. So anyway, so we get we we end up getting in there and and we're we're we're walking along and all of a sudden these two two people come up and they didn't say anything but we we sort of learned what it said and first thing was halt. And I looked at Marty and said, Did you say something? He said, No, I didn't say anything. So anyway, so then the next one was said, Holder will shoot. Wow. Then we turned around and uh there and there were their two security uh but fingerton fingerton guys or security guys, um you know, looking after uh Mamie Mamie Eisenhower. But we didn't know that right away until we got to the to the to the uh clubhouse and thought to one of security guys. He said, Yeah, well that they were watching were looking after Mamie. So now you go.

SPEAKER_01 22:29

And that was the same masters when you started the tradition of skipping the golf ball?

SPEAKER_03 22:34

Uh yeah, no, I did that in seventy two.

SPEAKER_01 22:38

Okay, the next year.

SPEAKER_03 22:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:59

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:00

Well that was with Ben Crenshaw.

SPEAKER_02 23:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:03

You know, so we're playing and and uh I just I just uh you know, we're playing the 16th hole and and we hit the shots and like I knew I was gonna do it uh because um you know I do it all the time and and then I just thought well I'll give it a go. So then I did it. And that's that's how this all started.

SPEAKER_01 23:27

Did you was that something you did when you was a kid when you were a kid? When did you start doing that?

SPEAKER_03 23:33

Oh I but I I probably did it for uh 15 years before that. It it's just like skipping a stone.

SPEAKER_02 23:40

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:40

You know, that's how I used to do it. So instead of that, you put your gall balls. Whenever I got near water, I would want to skip one across to see how far I could get it.

SPEAKER_02 23:49

Uh huh.

SPEAKER_03 23:49

How many skips I could make.

SPEAKER_02 23:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 23:51

You know, I've had I've had it, some of them where I've had made 20 skips. Wow. So I knew well what was going on.

SPEAKER_01 24:01

Yeah. And you did it uh recently, right? The the masters asked you to to kind of like replay that?

SPEAKER_03 24:07

Yeah, I did it la this past year. So there was a nice, uh nice uh video on that.

SPEAKER_01 24:15

And then uh a couple years after that, you you played in an exhibition match at Royal Montreal with Trevino, Palmer, and Player, and Trevino shot 64. You remember that?

SPEAKER_03 24:25

Yeah, I remember that, yeah. And uh it was it was like uh and then the uh the money was for charity, and whenever we got any of us got a birdie, that was five thousand dollars. So I think we had like I don't know, twenty birdies. Four of us.

SPEAKER_01 24:45

So yeah. So that was good. And then your your last masters was in 72?

SPEAKER_03 24:51

73. 73 What do you seventy-one gets me in for two more years?

SPEAKER_01 24:58

Okay. What what are your last memories of playing at the Masters? What do you remember most? What do you enjoy thinking about?

SPEAKER_03 25:07

Well, uh it it's like like I've I've I've played in eight of them. And and and I I I probably played there 200 times because because I got to know uh Cliff Roberts and that because I'd go down like two or three weeks before the tournament and and uh just go there and and play golf. Okay so uh so I knew a lot of these people, and I got to know a lot of the members as well. So we'd go out and have have dinner at the club and so on and so forth. So that's how I got to know uh Zip Roberts and and a lot of his stories and that. So there's there's a lot of stuff that that I can remember even even after I I um stopped the um stopped going to the masters uh as a player, I still went for like ten or fifteen years as uh an it like an invitee kind of thing. So I got to know Cliff quite well. They really treated I I I enjoyed him all new stories and that.

SPEAKER_01 26:15

They really treated the amateur players um great, didn't they?

SPEAKER_03 26:19

Yes, they did, yeah. And and so it should be. I mean, it was started by Bobby Jones, and that's what he was, so it was great.

SPEAKER_01 26:29

Uh tell me a little bit about the decision, you know, to turn pro as a senior after all that time as an amateur.

SPEAKER_03 26:39

Uh well it's it it it's uh I I was I was gonna I was getting a divorce, so I just said to myself, well, I think I'm gonna go play golf now. So uh basically what I did. That that's all about all I I could say on that.

SPEAKER_01 26:55

Uh but you you got to compete in the senior British Open?

SPEAKER_03 26:59

Uh yeah, that's that was the only time I'd ever been across the pond was I played in the senior open at Royal Lithuania. And that was basically the only time I'd ever been there. But I knew that that I uh uh I could have played there because I can hit the I could hit the ball low, which is what you had to do around there. So anyway, long story.

SPEAKER_01 27:23

And long gone.

unknown 27:25

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:27

Um and then you had a s you suffered a stroke in in 1997. Right.

SPEAKER_03 27:34

And that was the end of me.

SPEAKER_01 27:36

Was it was it something that um came out of nowhere? Were you d were you feeling lousy?

SPEAKER_03 27:44

No, no, I have no idea. Uh that's why it's called the stroke.

SPEAKER_02 27:49

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 27:49

You don't know when it's gonna happen or how or why.

SPEAKER_01 27:52

And w tell me about the road to recovery, getting to play golf again after after that. Was it tough?

SPEAKER_03 27:59

Well, yeah, well it was tough, but but um I I can remember um one of the doctors, and I and I guess he didn't know or whatever that I played golf. So when he he said to me, he said, well, you know what the best thing for you is to do is is to, you know, walk around and play some golf and so on just to you know, just to, you know, to get get feeling better again kind of thing. And uh so I said to myself, well, he doesn't know I play golf. Well, he knows he knows that uh I'll I'll belong in a match so so that's what I did. I used golf as my menstrual stick. Mm-hmm and uh and that's how that's how I got to uh things get a little better, so but I mean I couldn't hit it 30 yards before that after my stroke. Wow. So it took me years and years and years to to to get things, even now. I I I I've lost a lot of uh depth perception and stuff like that, but I'm still alive.

SPEAKER_01 29:02

And you're you're still probably shooting your age.

SPEAKER_03 29:05

Oh, I've been shooting my age since 1960 when I was 60. Wow.

SPEAKER_01 29:12

How how often do you play now?

SPEAKER_03 29:16

I play about maybe four times a week.

SPEAKER_01 29:19

And um you you made a nice little trip down here to to Marion and to to Wilmington. You wanted to see those places uh you haven't been to in a long time.

SPEAKER_03 29:29

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So uh we we made a made I made arrangements to uh to go and uh it was fantastic. We just had a w a wonderful time. I I think uh I think Marion, uh Marion was the best uh um you know uh as you at the golf course and and uh um you know because of the uh the just the way it's all set up and has been for a long time.

SPEAKER_02 29:57

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 29:58

Pine Pine Valley is uh a little tougher golf course, but it's it's um we we had uh we had a decision the decision, but we decided who who who thinks it's the best or whatever, and we we uh we both ch we all chose uh Maria. So that's great. That's it.

SPEAKER_01 30:20

Is it hard to believe that so the the USM will be here again in 2026, right? So 60 years uh after your win. Is that hard to believe that it'll be sixty years?

SPEAKER_03 30:34

Yeah, maybe I'll come down for it.

SPEAKER_01 30:36

You should. Yeah. I'm sure the club would love to have you.

SPEAKER_03 30:41

Yeah. Well we'll we'll see. Every every day every day is a new day for me.

SPEAKER_01 30:48

One of the things that I really enjoyed at the end of the book was how you you included that section about the light l the lessons that you learned earning golf, you know, things from Trevino and Sneed.

SPEAKER_02 30:59

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:59

Was that something that you knew you wanted to put in the book, something that you thought about later?

SPEAKER_03 31:04

Um well, no, that was it was all it was all part of it actually. I just I just uh just the way it was the way it was set up that way, it it it worked well.

SPEAKER_01 31:17

And you you honored some friends too at the end, which you know really kind of made me think that you you recognize that although you you did a lot of the work, you had some people help you along the way in your your golf journey.

SPEAKER_03 31:31

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, there was always a lot of people that that that um helped me out.

SPEAKER_01 31:39

Um and then you had some people tell some short stories about playing golf with you, which I like too at the end.

SPEAKER_03 31:45

Yeah, yeah, that was all that was all part of it. There was there was there was there was all kinds of little things there that um uh you know that that I thought, well they should go in, so I just I called uh or emailed a number of people said uh, you know, any any any suggestions or questions or whatever you might have, just send me an email. So that's a whole lot of that stuff got in the book.

SPEAKER_01 32:12

Is the book available like through Golf Canada? Can people buy it?

SPEAKER_03 32:17

Yeah, through Golf Canada. Okay, that's the only place that it that'll be sold.

SPEAKER_01 32:23

And I'm sure you're really proud of how it turned out. It's it's really a great read.

SPEAKER_03 32:28

Yeah, well, thank you for saying that, and uh I'm proud of it. Very proud.

SPEAKER_01 32:35

Are you playing golf today? Or are you playing golf today?

SPEAKER_03 32:41

Uh not today. Today's uh member guest day, the afternoon today.

SPEAKER_01 32:46

Okay.

SPEAKER_03 32:47

So I got I have stuff to do, so uh so that'll uh uh you know, I'm just trying to get a few things straightened away and so on and so forth.

SPEAKER_01 32:57

So all right. Thanks, Gary. I really appreciate your time, and I I hope I see you here in 2026.

SPEAKER_03 33:05

Well, that would be great. So uh let's just make sure that you're around and uh whatever. So uh it's been nice talking with you too, Nate.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

All right, you too. Take care.

SPEAKER_03 33:15

All right, bye-bye.

SPEAKER_00 33:18

Well, that's it for this episode of That's Good Pick It Up, hosted by Nate Oxman. If you enjoyed this, please subscribe and like this podcast and many other podcasts. Nate will be back next week.